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The sugestion of Camera Settings
09-14-2016, 01:04 AM
Post: #1
The sugestion of Camera Settings
I felt also other inconvenience in the process of performing a set of Pov-Ray export.
Wings3D's Menu: View > Camera Settings...
Negative Size preset is less (exist only two aspect ration).
Quote:-------- In currently -------------------
24 × 36 mm [3:2] : Fullsize : Leica size, 135 film
60 × 60 mm [1:1] : 120 film
"Custom"
In set "Custom" ,but it doesn't change put the other numbers.

For example, is it necessary lenses, such as the following?
Quote:45 x 60 mm [4:3] : 120 film 645 format
34 x 60 mm [16:9]


Also an another sugestion,
Is it possible to confirm the change of the camera view in real time?
This will help users to understand changing of view.
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09-14-2016, 07:02 AM (This post was last modified: 09-14-2016 07:03 AM by micheus.)
Post: #2
RE: The sugestion of Camera Settings
tkbd, I added the two new options.
Doing that I noticed the dialog was not working correctly, since the the input field for Width and Height are enabled for all formats except for Custom. It was inverted and I fixed it too. Smile

About the preview I don't know what to say. Undecided

My Wings3D Collection at G+
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09-15-2016, 10:07 PM
Post: #3
RE: The sugestion of Camera Settings
Micheus Wrote:I added the two new options.
Doing that I noticed the dialog was not working correctly, since the the input field for Width and Height are enabled for all formats except for Custom.
Thank you add the options!

Quote:About the preview I don't know what to say.

My explanation was not enough...
This means,I hope that camera-lens setting could checking at real time.
I recorded as a desktop movie the operation of "Position Camera Numeric" feature in the comparative subject.(0:00 - 0:23)
And current "Camera Settings" operation(0:24 - end)

See a following the movie.



(If it is difficult to read blurred text in the video,please set quality to 400p)
It is hard job to see the many times until to get best results.
For this reason I didn't use much of this feature.
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09-16-2016, 12:09 AM
Post: #4
RE: The sugestion of Camera Settings
I think it's possible. I'll try. Smile

My Wings3D Collection at G+
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09-17-2016, 05:37 AM
Post: #5
RE: The sugestion of Camera Settings
By adding the preview option to the camera dialog I realize that some extra data are necessary to make it work fine with those two extra negative format I added:
Quote: [{"24x36 [3:2]" ,{24,36}},
{"34x60 [16:9]",{34,60}},
{"45x60 [4:3]" ,{45,60}},

{"60x60 [1:1]" ,{60,60}},
{?__(4,"Custom"),custom}],

I have not idea about which values in the code bellow I have to add for these two new options:
Code:
camera_lens_length({34,60}, LensType) ->
    float(case LensType of
              ???
      end);
camera_lens_length({45,60}, LensType) ->
    float(case LensType of
              ???
      end);
camera_lens_length({24,36}, LensType) ->
    float(case LensType of
          wide_angle      -> 24;
          moderate_wide_angle -> 35;
          standard          -> 50;
          short_tele      -> 85;
          tele          -> 135
      end);
camera_lens_length({60,60}, LensType) ->
    float(case LensType of
          wide_angle      -> 40;
          moderate_wide_angle -> 60;
          standard          -> 80;
          short_tele      -> 150;
          tele          -> 250
      end);

Do you have any idea?

My Wings3D Collection at G+
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09-17-2016, 09:03 AM (This post was last modified: 09-18-2016 12:58 AM by Ratmapper.)
Post: #6
RE: The sugestion of Camera Settings
Hi!

Dgud asked me to give some info on this matter, since I wrote the original dialog.

I looked up the Pentax 645 on Wikipedia and it has as you say a negative size of 45 x 60 mm. The article shows a picture of one "with a 75 mm normal lens", and normally a normal lens has the length of the diagonal of the negative, which in this case matches perfectly (sqrt(60^2 + 45^2) = 75).

So the normal lens is 75 mm for that negative format. For the other lenses i did choose common lens lengths for the format I knew i.e 24x36, so if we scale these lengths from 50 mm normal lens to 75 mm normal lens we get: wide angle: 35 mm (36), moderate wide angle: 55 mm (52.5), standard: 75 mm, short tele: 135 mm (127.5), tele: 200 mm (202.5). I have looked up the lenses in the same wikipedia article and rounded from their corresponding 24x36 lens.

I have not found a camera with 34x60 mm negative format. Have you invented that one to get a 16:9 widescreen format? If so the invented lens lengths should be 33, 48, 69(standard), 117, and 186 mm.

Looking at the 120 film still cameras does not give much. 16:9 would correspond to 6x10.6 and the closest known (Wikipedia, again) are 6x9 (same aspect ratio as 24x26) and 6x12 (16:8?) - a bit off.

There should be some 70 mm movie film camera that has got 16:9, but I do not know if there is any point in having lenses from such for the amateur unknown cameras in the lens dialog...

Today the sensor size of digital cameras seldom follows any standard, so having a fabricated negative size for 16:9 maybe is just fine. But may I since 24x36 still seems to be the norm (everybody knows what an 85 mm short tele does even if it is not 85 mm) suggest an invented negative format of 22x39 (16:9) with the same lens lengths as for 24x36? Otherwise a negative format of 9x16 units with lenses 8.8, 13, 18(standard), 31 and 50 units.

Another approach could be to look at what happens in a contemporary full frame (small format (24x36 mm)) digital camera. If you tell it to use 4:3 it would crop the image on the sides to 24x32 mm, and for 16:9 top and bottom to 20.25x36 mm. But you still use the same lenses i.e 24, 35, 50(standard), 85 and 135 mm.
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09-20-2016, 03:10 AM
Post: #7
RE: The sugestion of Camera Settings
Ratmapper, thanks for the tips.
After read that I was able to know what look for and it seems the answer is to apply a multiplier to the full-frame(35mm or 24x36) lens length, that is the Crop Factor.
Here are some useful links about this subject: I'm going to do that and see what happens. Smile

My Wings3D Collection at G+
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09-24-2016, 04:13 AM
Post: #8
RE: The sugestion of Camera Settings
Good references!

I think today it is probably wisest to use "full frame" as the norm i.e 135 format film i.e 24x36 mm negative size since all cameras with smaller sensors compare themselves with the "full frame" previously known as "small format".

The number of photographers used to 6x6 cm and larger are getting smaller by the years. When I wrote the original dialogue 6x6 was still used. Now the biggest Hasselblad (medium format) sensor I find is 5.3 x 4.0 cm.

So pretend you have a 24x36 negative, traditional lens set, and crop to the desired aspect ratio.
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09-24-2016, 04:21 AM
Post: #9
RE: The sugestion of Camera Settings
If accepted the pull request, it will be a nice feature in order to properly set the camera to best fit the scene:


The renders plugins will need to manage these information too in order to render the scene in the same way we are seeing

My Wings3D Collection at G+
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09-24-2016, 09:11 AM (This post was last modified: 09-24-2016 09:13 AM by oort.)
Post: #10
RE: The sugestion of Camera Settings
Micheus,
Since in YafaRay (I think the others as well) the Geometry Window size affects the framing of the rendered image, should you add these different sizes as options in the "Set Window Size" dialog in the Geometry Window (RMB > Size)???

oort
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